Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

So you have your CoC but no job? - Read this!

Collapse
This is a sticky topic.
X
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • So you have your CoC but no job? - Read this!

    Having had a number of conversations with people this week I have first of all got some advice to offer to all those of you who are unfortunate to not have a job now that you have a shiny new CoC that you have sweated blood and tears for over the last 3 years.

    When I finished my cadetship and was told I was being made redundant I was handed a tired photocopied list of all the addresses and phone numbers of every Shipping Company in the world. I am sure we can do better than that now. Therefore I propose starting a new thread, which any of the mods can keep up to date with a table in of names, addresses, contact names, email addresses and other information to help people look for a job. The thread is HERE

    Secondly you need to have a very specific approach to sending out prospecting letters to Companies. If you just find a company name, address, and generic email address and send your cv and covering letter off you are likely to get nowhere because you have no ability to follow it up properly and no idea who has seen it.

    So let me try and help you to get your CV and letter in front of the right person. You MUST also send a copy of your CoC. They will need to know you have it and so it is better to have a scan of it with your CV.

    First of all, for male substitute female and for female substitute male in all of the following. I will just use generalities.

    "Sell the sizzle - not the sausage"
    Talking to people over the phone and giving them the chance to turn you down is a sure fired way to a slow death. Every communication has to have a goal. to get you in front of the decision maker, either in person or via documents. When teaching people to do cold calling you teach them to get the appointment in front of the decision maker not to talk to the decision maker over the phone. So they go through a process to get an appointment to see the right person face to face.

    It is the same for you. You need to get your information in front of the right person, or more ideally, get yourself in front of them.

    If you have a contact number ring it and speak to reception. Do not tell them your life story or what you want. Just ask a simple question. "Can you tell me the name of the person responsible for the recruitment of Deck / Engineer Officers please?" Do not elaborate, unless pushed, just get the name. Now, you can push your luck a little and ask if they have a direct line number or and email address. If Reception will not give it to you then be polite, say thank you and hang up. I do not suggest you ask to be put through to the person because it is unlikely that you will be. Before you ring off ask for the name of the person you are speaking to on reception - it helps to be friendly later. For the sake of this exercise you have been given the name Derek Shackle and the receptionist is Louise!

    Now wait a few days, use the time to do this process with a number of companies. You need to know that the receptionist has a job to do - direct people to the right people and to keep people out. Not in a nasty way - just in a gatekeeper way. People have jobs to do and so reception get told "don't put calls through to my line" and so they need to filter. So you need to learn how to dance around them!

    Before you make the call tell yourself "sell the sizzle, not the sausage." Your next call should go like this when the receptionist answers "Derek please". If reception asks which Derek make sure you just say "Sorry, Derek Shackle". No chit chat....."Who's calling please?" you say "Tell him it is Freddy - sorry Fred Smith.". This sounds like you know him and therefore she has a choice - put you through or seek further information from you with either "Will he know what it is about?" or "what is it regarding?" then you know you have a rottweiler and you need to say something simple like "I am discussing Officer placements with him." Again she has a choice, but it is bordering on rude and she still has no idea if you are Derek's best mate, biggest client or employee, and therefore is risking a bollocking if she is wrong.

    Now comes a bit of a kicker unless you are ready for it. "He is out of the office, do you want to leave a voicemail?" The best answer for this is "No thanks, I will call back later. Is that Louise?" Yes or no - you have touched base or got another name! Another response is "He is on the phone, can I take a message?" - The answer to this is "It is not urgent I will call him back later if that is alright Louise?" If you do not have an email address you could try, "It might be best to email him, can I check his email address please?" - you might get it!

    The next time you ring back you are now becoming a bit more familiar to dear Louise so you start with "Hi Louise, it's Freddy, is Derek in, we seem to be playing telephone tag."

    90% of the time you will get to speak to the right person. Now open the conversation with "Hello Mr Shackle my name is Fred Smith. I was told you are the person responsible for the recruitment of new Officers, are you able to give me five minutes of your time please? This is a danger point - you should avoid single questions with a simple yes / no response as it can close down a conversation. This is a double question so they usually cannot answer with a single yes/no answer. Now you still need to sell the sizzle and not the sausage. Have a quick conversation, ask him if you can send over your CV or arrange a meeting. Get their email address if they will not see you, and do not start to flannel and tell your life story. Get off the phone with a closing statement of "I will call you in a few days once you have had time to read my letter and CV." The bold move is to ask to come down and see them face to face for a chat once you have emailed over your CV. But make sure you can follow it up and go and see them. They will not pay you to do it or organise it for you!

    Now send it over and keep your word - follow up! Ring, ask questions about possibilities and if you get the brush off do not let go, ask if they have any leads for you, tell them you will ring them in a month and follow up. The line between follow up and pestering is slim - so be careful. You want them on your side and to help you, so keep it friendly and constructive.

    Whatever you do - do not lose heart, follow up on everything and do not give up. I remember sending off 35 letters in my first batch - having tried to get a contact name for every one. (No, we did not have email in those days!) The first response I got was from a particular person at Maersk who was impressed because my letter was addressed directly to him. Next thing I had an interview, psychometric tests and off to join the Maersk Buchan all within a couple of weeks!

    Finally, do not take it personally. Many people do not respond to you, or even acknowledge you. They do the same to everyone. Move on, try another, and if it all gets too much come on here and kick a box around the car park - we will cock an ear and listen to your despondent rants!

    I hope this helps someone.

    Good luck.

    Ian
    "Any damn fool can navigate the world sober. It takes a really good sailor to do it drunk." - Sir Francis Chichester.
    "Waves are not measured in feet or inches, they are measured in increments of fear." - Buzzy Trent

    "Careers at Sea" Ambassador - Experience of General Cargo, Combo ships, Tanker, Product Carrier, Gas Carrier, Ro-Ro, Reefer Container, Anchor Handlers.

  • #2
    Love it, receptionists must love you Hatch. My hubby's pa is a Rottweiler, she's very nice actually she'll enjoy this one. Not shipping so you are all safe!
    I just love the ones that phone up and try and scam, I have such entertaining moments with them.

    Thanks for doing this, I'm sure they'll appreciate the effort.

    Comment


    • #3
      Putting my money where my mouth is this morning I decided to see if I could do this myself still!

      I had 2 sets of contact details for DOF:

      DOF Subsea UK Ltd
      Exchange No.1
      62 Market St.
      Aberdeen
      AB11 5PJ
      Phone: 01224 614000
      uk@dofsubsea.com

      and

      DOF (UK) Ltd
      Geo House
      Commerce Street
      Aberdeen
      AB11 5FN
      Phone: 01224 586644
      info@dofman.co.uk

      I rang DOF Subsea first, followed the script and was told that their recruitment is handled by CSL in the same building, but was told that the 2 people I needed to speak to were Michele Demay and Rebecca Mitchell. (checked the spelling of both but could not get their email addresses, direct lines or titles!) A quick search of Facebook and Linkedin told me that Michele is Operational Services Manager and Rebecca Mitchell is a Mrs now!

      Now I rang DOF Management and suddenly realised I was talking to the same receptionist! Foul I hear you say.... A quick recovery, a bit of a chat to identify the differences between the 2 companies and the receptionists name was Claire! Good recovery! Said I would contact CSL on 01224 285566.

      Rang CSL and got - Claire! - same building - shared reception! Asked to speak to Michele (on annual leave), asked to speak to Rebecca and was told she was not answering. Asked if I wanted to leave a message I politely refused and rang off!

      30 minutes later I started with "Hello Claire, can you try Rebecca for me again please?" - "Who's calling" - "Ian again" - she put me through.....

      Rebecca told me that they handle all of the short term recruitment for on board technical staff and only once in a blue moon for deck and engineering officer. Willing to give me her email address but thought it would be a waste of time. She did tell me that DOF management handle the recruitment of sea staff through an agency she thought was in Singapore but as the DOF Management were in the same building she would take my details and get someone from there to ring me or email me later today when they come out of a meeting.

      So, I got nowhere really - I do not have a contact name and email address - yet!

      On the upside I have a date with Claire tonight! - Someone tell the wife I am out please...... (OK - I made this last bit up!) But she was lovely to talk to, kind, and no Rottweiler!

      If I do not hear by middle of next week I will give Rebecca a call and see if she can drop a name and email address for the right person in DOF Management!

      Think I will have a have a go at another one now! - Dammit! I will not be beaten.......

      Someone give me a list of Companies please....

      Ian.
      "Any damn fool can navigate the world sober. It takes a really good sailor to do it drunk." - Sir Francis Chichester.
      "Waves are not measured in feet or inches, they are measured in increments of fear." - Buzzy Trent

      "Careers at Sea" Ambassador - Experience of General Cargo, Combo ships, Tanker, Product Carrier, Gas Carrier, Ro-Ro, Reefer Container, Anchor Handlers.

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm looking forward to the next instalment! I'm stuck waiting for the politicians ( campaign thing I'm involved with which has been taking up hours of my time) for the moment seeing what they come up with next, so I could do with some entertainment whilst I'm waiting.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Midge View Post
          Love it, receptionists must love you Hatch. My hubby's pa is a Rottweiler, she's very nice actually she'll enjoy this one. Not shipping so you are all safe!
          I just love the ones that phone up and try and scam, I have such entertaining moments with them.

          Thanks for doing this, I'm sure they'll appreciate the effort.
          You see Midge, none of what you say in the script is a lie, or a scam, just an economy of the truth. Therefore you can be confident when you deliver it. You are right though. The number of people who I have spoken to in the past who have said "How did you get past reception / my PA?" is funny. I hope nobody ever got into trouble over it though!

          Come on peoples - lets get cracking!

          Ian
          "Any damn fool can navigate the world sober. It takes a really good sailor to do it drunk." - Sir Francis Chichester.
          "Waves are not measured in feet or inches, they are measured in increments of fear." - Buzzy Trent

          "Careers at Sea" Ambassador - Experience of General Cargo, Combo ships, Tanker, Product Carrier, Gas Carrier, Ro-Ro, Reefer Container, Anchor Handlers.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Hatchorder View Post
            You see Midge, none of what you say in the script is a lie, or a scam, just an economy of the truth. Therefore you can be confident when you deliver it. You are right though. The number of people who I have spoken to in the past who have said "How did you get past reception / my PA?" is funny. I hope nobody ever got into trouble over it though!

            Come on peoples - lets get cracking!

            Ian
            oh yes it will work, I've done similar things myself. My boss has it well worked out he just disappears and we have no idea where he is! It drives me nuts. I have stood in front of the door and not let him out before when we have needed things signed, as he just sneaks off otherwise.

            Comment


            • #7
              Gift of the gab!

              Comment


              • #8
                If Hatch applied for a job with me I'd be too scared to refuse him
                io parlo morse

                Comment


                • #9
                  You could try Foreland Shipping who recruit British Officer through Bibby Ship Management (Western Europe) Ltd in the Isle of Man.
                  Go out, do stuff

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I've gotta ask, did this actually work in the end? I'm tempted to take note of this for future uses, seems effective to someone whos done IT recruitment.

                    I've saw a similar technique to this when the Local Authority I currently work at was looking for a developer. The same guy would call up every day after he had his interview looking for informaiton on how he got on. What he didn't realise is that the inferview was just a formality to ensure he wasn't a prat. If you get an interview with us you get offered a job!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Fantastic Article Ian. Enjoyable reading even for the employed!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Oh my goodness - I had forgotten all about it...........

                        Sorry!

                        I failed to follow up on this. Wish I had now. But it was really good of you to bring it forwards again - maybe it will help someone who did not see it at the time.

                        I have far too much time on my hands sometimes!

                        Ian.
                        "Any damn fool can navigate the world sober. It takes a really good sailor to do it drunk." - Sir Francis Chichester.
                        "Waves are not measured in feet or inches, they are measured in increments of fear." - Buzzy Trent

                        "Careers at Sea" Ambassador - Experience of General Cargo, Combo ships, Tanker, Product Carrier, Gas Carrier, Ro-Ro, Reefer Container, Anchor Handlers.

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X