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  • #31
    There are a few queries 4% without a job? But what jobs are they actually doing. Do 96% have jobs doing what they trained to do?
    Looking at what job adverts there are out there over the past 18 months or so, for junior officers roles are few and far between and has only got worse, as now there are often requirements of X number of months or sometimes years in rank. Deck positions are the worst for this, I've seen more Engine and ETO job opportunities.

    Whilst it may not be ideal for NQ officers to go for AB positions most people need work to live. Those qualified ABS
    looking for work or change company will now have a host of NQ OOW also applying for positions and competing with them.
    It's great that companies who train their own employ them at the end, after all there is this huge shortage of qualified officers according to various reports, the reports however don't seem to be reflecting what you see advertised.

    When there have been personnel shortgages in other industries, I have seen pages of jobs advertised, pay increasing, and recruiters personnel agencies chasing candidates, and offering retraining if they could get someone, anyone.
    We are not seeing this in seagoing junior positions. Masters, Chief mates, Chief Engineers lots of superintendent, types roles I see advertised as for pay for those, I wouldn't know.

    IF Those who say there are plenty of jobs out there for new officers with no experience would like to post a list of them, I'm sure those 4% would be delighted to apply for them. Or PM them to me.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by SeaGazer View Post
      Isnt this a contradiction in one sentence? Or do you mean there are jobs out there performed by OOWs but not open positions available? In which case how is your statement a counter argument...
      There is very little movement at the moment, which I feel is principally due to the effects of what is happening in the offshore sector. People are remaining with their current employers longer which means their is little prospect of open positions becoming available. For many larger employers the Junior OOW jobs have always been filled from their Cadets, whereas others recruit as and when required.

      I am optimistic it will improve but who knows when.

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      • #33
        What newbies is saying if I am correct ...is that currently most new junior position are being filled in companies by their own cadets. Eg Carnival takes on X number of cadets and then they fill the X number of vacancies they have. Previously they might have taken a few extra that weren't their excadets. This is repeated across the companies...leaving less open postions.Previously their were vacancies in the North Sea ..which have dried up.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by newbie View Post
          There is very little movement at the moment, which I feel is principally due to the effects of what is happening in the offshore sector. People are remaining with their current employers longer which means their is little prospect of open positions becoming available. For many larger employers the Junior OOW jobs have always been filled from their Cadets, whereas others recruit as and when required.

          I am optimistic it will improve but who knows when.
          Classic summing up of a stagnanted industry with little growth and a known decline in the offshore sector, except cruise which seems to be growing judging by the number of new ships they seem to have. It wasn't that long ago I recall people complaining junior officers were being promoted too quickly before gaining enough experience to be moving up. I guess now that isn't the case so much. Rarely ever see any 2/O jobs coming up so guess internal promotion within companies is the reason.
          When it booms or get busy people often move company to gain better pay offered elsewhere or quicker promotion and create gaps where others not taken on as NQO because they have been cadets with training companies then get the chance to get a foot in the door.
          Or the alternative is that companies are sourcing cheaper employees from elsewhere. Companies will always be looking to cut costs, and the best ones will do it as long as they don't compromise their reputation or business by doing so. Essentially companies are heartless and soulesss. Getting cynical in my old age, dont believe all of the our employees are the most important thing to us bit, seen far too many cut jobs because it makes the numbers work over the years, even some of the best well known global groups (all industries) will do it when the bottom line isn't looking too favourable.

          I wouldnt say Im a pessimist but it's such an uncertain world, there are so many balls up in the air, and none have a clue as to who will catch them and just what they'll do once they have them in their hands!

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          • #35
            So we saying only get a cadetship with a cruise line or oil major or possibly a ferry company

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            • #36
              I have just said goodbye to my son as he joins his first ship as an extra 3rd Officer. For five months he looked for work applying to over 100 shipping companies and agencies. With about 60 automated replies he at least knew his applications where getting through but he only received about 20 replies most of whom praised the quality of his CV but had no job vacancies.

              His cadet sponsoring shipping company provided him with funding for the four-year university BSc (Hons) degree course and provided excellent onboard training during his sea phases. Sounds good but two years in the shipping company decided to no longer employ British officers and several seagoing British officers found themselves unemployed.

              It was his Cadet Recruitment Agency that passed his CV to a shipping company which has resulted in the job opportunity. Before sailing he had to complete a Bridge Team Management Course and have a full medical. Yes, a full medical, the ENG1 was not excepted. This time it was a six-hour medical with a team of Consultants, all with their specialities including ECGs, X-Rays, Treadmills, etc.

              On joining his ship the first comment to him was “What are you doing here?” Sometime later this comment changed to “You are a British Officer, what are you doing here?” He is one of only two or three Brits in the company. The ship is new, very big, good accommodation and food. The wages are somewhat poor, as he said “I could earn more stacking shelves in Tesco!” It’s all about getting the first six months under your belt and his future with this company does look bright starting when he does become the 3rd Officer onboard.

              When talking to potential cadets looking for a career at sea one needs to be somewhat more transparent about life after cadetship and this requirement for six months as an Officer needs to addressed with some urgency.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by OldSalt View Post
                I have just said goodbye to my son as he joins his first ship as an extra 3rd Officer. For five months he looked for work applying to over 100 shipping companies and agencies. With about 60 automated replies he at least knew his applications where getting through but he only received about 20 replies most of whom praised the quality of his CV but had no job vacancies.

                His cadet sponsoring shipping company provided him with funding for the four-year university BSc (Hons) degree course and provided excellent onboard training during his sea phases. Sounds good but two years in the shipping company decided to no longer employ British officers and several seagoing British officers found themselves unemployed.

                It was his Cadet Recruitment Agency that passed his CV to a shipping company which has resulted in the job opportunity. Before sailing he had to complete a Bridge Team Management Course and have a full medical. Yes, a full medical, the ENG1 was not excepted. This time it was a six-hour medical with a team of Consultants, all with their specialities including ECGs, X-Rays, Treadmills, etc.

                On joining his ship the first comment to him was ?What are you doing here?? Sometime later this comment changed to ?You are a British Officer, what are you doing here?? He is one of only two or three Brits in the company. The ship is new, very big, good accommodation and food. The wages are somewhat poor, as he said ?I could earn more stacking shelves in Tesco!? It?s all about getting the first six months under your belt and his future with this company does look bright starting when he does become the 3rd Officer onboard.

                When talking to potential cadets looking for a career at sea one needs to be somewhat more transparent about life after cadetship and this requirement for six months as an Officer needs to addressed with some urgency.
                Glad he found a job, didn't get to meet you at the graduation, but met galley slave. It's tough out there!

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by OldSalt View Post
                  The wages are somewhat poor, as he said “I could earn more stacking shelves in Tesco!” .

                  This is a total shame if it is true. An officer can't be paid as much as a worker doing a unqualified job.

                  If he is sure to have prospects of evolution in this comapny, he did a good choice to go for it.

                  If the chances are slim , turning off this slave paid job would be the most reasonable decision.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by ratguardking View Post
                    This is a total shame if it is true. An officer can't be paid as much as a worker doing a unqualified job.

                    If he is sure to have prospects of evolution in this comapny, he did a good choice to go for it.

                    If the chances are slim , turning off this slave paid job would be the most reasonable decision.
                    That's right. It's always better to be unemployed than have at least some money coming in and 6 months worth of stamps in your discharge book, especially if it's your first trip. Jeez.
                    io parlo morse

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                    • #40
                      I recently couldn't find a job so bit the bullet and PAID to join a hospital ship operating out of Africa. I loved it and I believe it to be worth it. Now a year of being unemployed, I hope I find something!

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                      • #41
                        At present the pendulum is swinging towards the shipping companies and away from the Officers. For my son, it is a new company with their own way of working. They have already sent him on one course ashore and will continue his training whilst onboard. He’s joined as an Extra 3rd Officer or Junior Officer, somewhere between a cadet and 3rd Officer. He is working the day shift, 8-12 and 4-8. The ship is big and a 12-month-old with all the latest technologies on the bridge – a far cry from the ships he sailed on as a cadet.

                        Working an 8-hour day, 30 days a month and paid in dollars (and we all know what is happening to the pound and dollar daily…) his wage is less than the national minimum wage of ?6.95p for his age, but at least it will be tax free. The company are happy to invest in him, train him and put him forward for his Chief’s ticket, but it all comes at a cost. After 6 months, he can go where he wants and the shipping company haven’t had to pay him much. But if he stays as 3rd Officer his wages go up well and his Chief Ticket awaits…

                        The situation for newly qualified Officers is far from brilliant now. At the end of the day it is your choice where you go. Weigh up what is on offer in the short term and long term, seek advice from those who have been there and make your own informed decision.

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                        • #42
                          Is he single? Does he have a mortgage? If not then the money is all his and he gets free board and lodgings into the bargain.
                          io parlo morse

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by endure View Post
                            Is he single? Does he have a mortgage? If not then the money is all his and he gets free board and lodgings into the bargain.
                            So that's all okay then I guess.... less than minimum wage working almost twice as many hours as someone ashore for 4 months at a time with no days off. Move along! No issues here!

                            What next newly qualified officers expected to work for food and accommodation only?

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by SeaGazer View Post
                              So that's all okay then I guess.... less than minimum wage working almost twice as many hours as someone ashore for 4 months at a time with no days off. Move along! No issues here!

                              What next newly qualified officers expected to work for food and accommodation only?

                              It's better then being unemployed - unless you're an entitled snowflake of course.
                              io parlo morse

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by SeaGazer View Post
                                So that's all okay then I guess.... less than minimum wage working almost twice as many hours as someone ashore for 4 months at a time with no days off. Move along! No issues here!

                                What next newly qualified officers expected to work for food and accommodation only?
                                You'd have thought the conditions would be better considering there is 140,000 shortage of officers!

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