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  • RT Flex

    Sorry but I am having a funny 5 minutes. I am looking at the RT Flex construction and what would happen in blackout in regards to WECs, injection and valve solenoids ... What happens ? Obviously FO pressure will drop whilst waiting for the emergency gen to start but does WECs loose power too (as in no UPS to the panel) and do the exhaust valves just drop to an open position due to loss of electronic timing and prevent damage?

  • #2
    As a deckie, what you just said is 90% greek to me I'm afraid. However, UPS shouldn't(?) be affected, it's our emergency power supply and without it all we have to rely on is the EG kicking in after 45 secs. (???) Franticly looks around for an engineer to help out now (???)

    Size4riggerboots

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    • #3
      Originally posted by AndyK View Post
      Sorry but I am having a funny 5 minutes. I am looking at the RT Flex construction and what would happen in blackout in regards to WECs, injection and valve solenoids ... What happens ? Obviously FO pressure will drop whilst waiting for the emergency gen to start but does WECs loose power too (as in no UPS to the panel) and do the exhaust valves just drop to an open position due to loss of electronic timing and prevent damage?
      Urm right, Chiefy may be the best one for this as he works with Flex Engines. At a complete and utter guess (and not knowing what a WEC stands for but guessing you mean an actuator) I would reckon that the engine will shut itself down as the Emergency Generator normally doesn't provide enough power to run enough pumps to keep the Main Engine going, just enough to run emergency equipment. As I said, total guess, wait for Chiefy to reply. Besides, bloody complicated things these Flex Engines....

      Originally posted by size4riggerboots View Post
      As a deckie, what you just said is 90% greek to me I'm afraid. However, UPS shouldn't(?) be affected, it's our emergency power supply and without it all we have to rely on is the EG kicking in after 45 secs. (???) Franticly looks around for an engineer to help out now (???)
      You guys have UPS's because there are lot of bits and bobs on the bridge that don't take kindly to being switched off in that manner and/or will cause havoc with other bits and doodads (technical terms) who all decide to reset themselves when switched back on...ugh.

      For instance, if power was to go out to your SSAS, it would start sending an alert as soon as it gets power again. From experience, Flag's 24 hour operations centre, CSO's and owner's reps don't like alarms from a ship's SSAS going off because some plonker has disconnected the power supply to the system (I had to spend two hours on the phone and send a number of grovelling messages at zero-dark-thirty to Flag, owners and what not because some prat powered down the system without telling anyone he was going to do it). Also, if the power is off for a while then that also triggers an alert when the system misses it's scheduled "I'm here!" email!

      As a small side note, if you do disconnect the UPS that powers the email server for your PMS replication, that causes havoc with that as well if it's all automated. Basically, it stops it from sending the email replication so they all get out of sync and if it's AMOS is a bloody nuisance to fix from the shoreside, throw in some computer illiterate officers, an IT department who moan about us using it in the first place without them being paid to help sort the issues with it out and it leads to a rather annoying downtime and quite possibly a trip to the ship to fix!
      I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by.....

      All posts here represent my own opinion and not that of my employer.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by AndyK View Post
        Sorry but I am having a funny 5 minutes. I am looking at the RT Flex construction and what would happen in blackout in regards to WECs, injection and valve solenoids ... What happens ? Obviously FO pressure will drop whilst waiting for the emergency gen to start but does WECs loose power too (as in no UPS to the panel) and do the exhaust valves just drop to an open position due to loss of electronic timing and prevent damage?
        Even Wartsila don't seem to know - have a look at some corporate guff - http://cmapspublic2.ihmc.us/rid=1159...ription_02.pdf
        Not all Trade Unionists are left wing, socialists or even ugly

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        • #5
          Originally posted by AndyK View Post
          Sorry but I am having a funny 5 minutes. I am looking at the RT Flex construction and what would happen in blackout in regards to WECs, injection and valve solenoids ... What happens ? Obviously FO pressure will drop whilst waiting for the emergency gen to start but does WECs loose power too (as in no UPS to the panel) and do the exhaust valves just drop to an open position due to loss of electronic timing and prevent damage?
          It's a while since I looked at a FLEX schematic, but it would be logical for there to be a UPS for the brain and solenoid controls, but as you note that would just keep it spinning until the fuel pressure collapses. IIRC the valve actuation is powered from a PTO, as is the HP fuel delivery, so if the engine's turning and the brain has power the exhaust valves keep working.
          '... English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't
          just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages
          down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for
          new vocabulary.' - James Davis Nicoll

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          • #6
            there isnt a UPS for the FCM's, there are however 2 power supplies from different sources.

            If the ship blacks out then everything stops, therefore the exhaust valves dont operate as they are oil actuated and there wont be any oil, they are held closed by the spring air. Injection is stopped again because there isnt any oil pressure, the HP fuel is dumped through the Pressure Regulating Valve which is also the Emergency stop system, so there is no HP fuel in the rail.

            As power is restored then the MELO pumps come on and then the control oil pumps (under sequential start) at that point the exhaust valves begin to operate again as the engine slows down...

            As the dust settles you can set off again

            Remember that 1 each of the FO Supply and Feed pumps (in the purifier room) are off the EG board, so come on as soon as it does, so that you can start the big gennies and get going a bit better and faster.

            I think that covers the question unless there is any suplemental

            BTW did you not take a copy of the "Blue Book" for the last ship when you left? pretty much most of it's in there, ditto the ME Manual.....
            Trust me I'm a Chief.

            Views expressed by me are mine and mine alone.
            Yes I work for the big blue canoe company.
            No I do not report things from here to them as they are quite able to come and read this stuff for themselves.


            Twitter:- @DeeChief

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            • #7
              When I was onboard a K class we blacked out whilst moving to test E D/G on load. I didn't think anything stopped ... I did ask my chief onboard but I got a vaccant expression and no answer....
              Engine Cadet | Phase 5 @ Warsash Maritime Academy

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              • #8
                No you can do a blackout test without blacking out..... it's not the same thing

                Simulated blackout is just that throw the breaker connecting the main and emergency boards, you will loose ONLY those things powered through the Emergency Board, so some pumps, 1 steering gear, the elevator, some computers. IF you are running (#2) fuel pumps then these will stop (until the EG starts) if you are running #1 THEN when the #2's will auto start when the EG comes on (safety feature remember you just simulated a dead ship), this has the potential to over pressurize the fuel system (all 4 pumps on), so I tend to put the #2's on manual stop, as we arent actually blacking out

                As the FCM's have 2 power supplies that feed them it matter not if 1 dies (that's the point ), so the feed from the EG can be lost with no ill effect on the ME, and as "most" stuff is off the main board then everything should be "grand gromit"

                NEXT
                Trust me I'm a Chief.

                Views expressed by me are mine and mine alone.
                Yes I work for the big blue canoe company.
                No I do not report things from here to them as they are quite able to come and read this stuff for themselves.


                Twitter:- @DeeChief

                Comment

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