Enclosed space entry

[gadget123]

Was just watching the emma mearsk episode of mighty ships, two of the officers carried out an enclosed space entry in the bilge with BA sets on and they had a gas meter showing how high the carbon monoxide levels were. Is this normal practice, I have always thought you should not enter a space if the atmosphere was unsafe?

[thady]

well they where wearing ba sets, saying that carbon monoxide is an explosive gas.

They seriously over dramatize these documentaries, though i do wonder why a bilge on a container ship has carbon monoxide in it. seems a little odd. can someone enlighten me on that please?

[GuinnessMan]

Knowing the way Maersk have done television shows in the past, chances are this was just them playing a bit for the cameras. Make it look a bit dodgy and dangerous or what not.

However, standard practice is: -

A) Positively Ventilate the tank for a minimum of 24 hours,
B) Lower a gas probe/sampling tube down and test the atmosphere towards the bottom and middle of the tank (normally take about 3 readings)
C) Make sure that the air is breathable and not liable to explode (check O2 and LEL levels. If on Tanker, also check H2S levels as well),
D) Ensure you have someone who is "competent" with a radio at the entrance to the enclosed space with a sign in/out sheet of who is in the tank,
E) This person should also have a SCBA, Medical and retrieval kits (including Stretcher) with them at the entrance,
F) Any other items within your SMS checklist should be completed before the Entry Permit is signed by Master. A copy of entry permit should be kept at entrance,
G) Ensure all radio's are working and have been tested prior to entry

During Entry: -

A) No less than 2 people in the tank at any one time,
B) Positive Ventilation should continue throughout, if the ventilation fails for any reason then the permit is no longer valid and everyone needs to exit the tank,
C) The people going into the tank should also carry personal gas meters with them. On tankers we normally carry a 4gas meter (as in it tracks 4 gas levels),
D) Every set number of hours test the atmosphere within the tank. If there has been a big change then everyone has to get out and permit is invalid.
E) Only intrinsic equipment can be carried inside a tank,
F) OOW to be notified with them going in and out,
G) Depending on tank, some companies require you to use guide lines (so we can find your corpse if it all goes wrong),

The above is just a general bit of the top of my head and I've intentionally not mentioned hot-work (thats a whole different thing and I'd be here all day). Remember that the permit is not valid for more than 12 hours (your SMS may stipulate less). Statistically, the highest number of ESE accidents occur aboard Dry-Cargo ships and in an effort to reduce these figures a project called the "Safe Space Project" ran by Marine Accident Casebook founder Bob Couttie is now in it's early stages. The idea behind the project is to reduce the number of these accidents through further education and I would highly advise that you all go and sign up.

[gadget123]

well they where wearing ba sets, saying that carbon monoxide is an explosive gas.

They seriously over dramatize these documentaries, though i do wonder why a bilge on a container ship has carbon monoxide in it. seems a little odd. can someone enlighten me on that please?

They said that the "bilges were poisonousness" something to do with the ship being new and the paint giving of carbon monoxide as it dries.

[GuinnessMan]

well they where wearing ba sets, saying that carbon monoxide is an explosive gas.

They seriously over dramatize these documentaries, though i do wonder why a bilge on a container ship has carbon monoxide in it. seems a little odd. can someone enlighten me on that please?

Since when was CO explosive?

[thady]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_monoxide

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_carbon_monoxide_gas_flammable

Thats what i thought but apparently its classified as highly explosive or am i missing something?

i didnt believe it when i heard in and i am still sceptical

[thady]

well i should have written flammable not explosive

[Ducki52]

Well I suppose it makes sense for it to be flammable; harking back to GCSE chemistry all it needs to become inert carbon dioxide is another oxygen molecule, which we all know is as reactive as a very reactive thing, so I would guess that under the right circumstances CO can go bang pretty well.

[GuinnessMan]

Well I suppose it makes sense for it to be flammable; harking back to GCSE chemistry all it needs to become inert carbon dioxide is another oxygen molecule, which we all know is as reactive as a very reactive thing, so I would guess that under the right circumstances CO can go bang pretty well.

Aye, but on a tanker I'd be more concerned with cargo vapours (especially if it's a white oil, MTBE or something else like that). Below is an example of what happens when MTBE explodes: -

[Chiefy]

Given they are worried about paint fumes, then CO isn't the issue, as such paint fumes can't be detected by the testing gear we have, however a Mk1 nose can detect it. Paint fumes are mainly solvents which are in the paint to make it applicable and then as the paint dries these are given off, they deplete the oxygen of the space.

CO kills people in the UK regularly, usually from badly maintained boilers and fires, which is why they keep pushing for detectors to be fitted, the persons die from asphxiation not exploding.

If the space was that fume filled they shouldnt have been going in in the first place...not for a routine inspection at least, in an emergency then maybe, but still need tto take full tank entry procedures. Enclosed spaces have killed and will kill again, even a chain locker can become a dangerous space, read up on the MAIB site about a couple of supply boats in North Sea not that long ago.

[Steve]

Remember that the permit is not valid for more than 12 hours...

When did that change?

[ETwhat?]

Will be getting a little reminder of all this on thursday before we go to the bow ballast tank to replace the log transducer. Not really looking forward to it.

[Chiefy]

When did that change?

Never, depends on company and ship type......we hve 6, 12, 24 hour permits depending on job type, vessel type and watch rotation, if i recall coswop says no permit is allowed to be active for 24 hours or more with out re-validation OR turning int a long term isolation