What's up with Maersk

[dawg]

Lot of bad news stories online about them giving western european crews the push off... and uncertainty over the chance of a job with them at the end of training.

Maersk did their interviews early to snatch cadets too nervous to wait for the bigger boys to reply.

Maersk have taken on 60, but may only employ 30... they pay ?8,024 training allowance, and you go on fixed trips: phase 2 from Miami through Panama to Singapore; and then in phase 4 from Sydney to Algeciras in Spain.

Any questions?!

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

Some links of interest:

http://www.joinourfleet.com/
http://www.maerskship-hk.com/careers/ca ... itment.php
http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/employment/maersk-company-the/
http://www.seacareers.co.uk/cadets/on_radar.html
http://www.nautilusint.org/News-and-Eve ... ?newsid=82
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=48303110834

...make of it what you will.

[Andy_S]

Re: What's up with Maersk

When I applied in early Feb they said they were already full.

From what I have read the training is very good at Maersk but the uncertainty of jobs at the end would put me off a bit. Saying that the economy might be much better in 3-4 years time when those of us applying now would graduate, so they might be taking on cadets again.

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

They opened for applications last Nov/Dec; had interviews in January and February. Offers were issued in Feb and March - a deliberate policy of theirs to get the best ones and leave the rest for the others.

high ratio of deck to engine... maybe 5:1.

Maersk oil is doing well, but the shipping side is getting tight...

[kayak]

Re: What's up with Maersk

Pfff they've lost out on me by going early. Someone else can have my AAAB predicted A levels...

(Not to sound cocky :P)

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

I said yes to them... not that it stops me from applying to anyone else or going to any other interviews... I haven't signed anything, but there seems no point in saying no.

[RedWhiteAndBlue]

Re: What's up with Maersk

I can only speak from personal experience here so keep that in mind. Im in my third phase with maersk, a few months a go we got pulled into an office to tell us there would be no jobs for us when we leave. The situation hasn't changed and it may even have got worse with rumours of people being paid off (not cadets).

As for the planned trips, thats not true, neither me nor anyone I know has had "set routes" for each sea phase. Maersk is a good company to do your cadetship with in my opinion, they look after you and they have high standards for cadets. Maersk have less people fail the course than other companies from what I have been told. The lack of job at the end of the cadetship might put some people off but its worth remembering that the training companies dont guarantee you jobs either.

[Chiefy]

Re: What's up with Maersk

They are also still building new ships with deliveries starting later next year upto 40 ships which will have to be manned by "someone". So by time anyone starting now is qualified there should be boats available. I do know they are short of captains at the moment having alowed too many to take redundancy earlier in the year (no I dont know how that works either!!!)

The general feeling higher up is it will become bums on seats, as the pool of talent (seafarers) is still getting smaller not just europeans but worldwide.

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

They are also still building new ships with deliveries starting later next year upto 40 ships which will have to be manned by "someone". So by time anyone starting now is qualified there should be boats available. I do know they are short of captains at the moment having alowed too many to take redundancy earlier in the year (no I dont know how that works either!!!)

The general feeling higher up is it will become bums on seats, as the pool of talent (seafarers) is still getting smaller not just europeans but worldwide.

I don't follow?
"Bums on seats" usually means "going through the motions" as I understand it... just filling up a quota... yet you imply that they're going to need more fresh meat on the conveyer belt for 40 new ships?

I can't imagine shipping companies would completely pull out of the European crew market, because they need to retain standards that can't be relied upon in developing (i.e. corrupt) countries, who have a culture of learning by rote - which is not really suited to engineering in general (I regard engineering as one of those subjects that isn't really a degree subject... it has to be part practical).
Big and very commercial companies have to maintain their QA and standards in a competitive market to maintain their position, and you need reliable crews from places that are conducive to taking that seriously, I wouldn't expect crews from places like Russia, Ukraine, Nigeria, Brazil, Philippines, India, and Burma (nor even Mediterranean ones) to be able to guarantee that to the extent that northwest European & Anglophone countries can.


I suppose the most likely thing is for them to go more EU east-european, but as those countries grow economically (and they are growing), the costs of those staff will rise over time, as more competing career alternatives become available in those places.
Globalisation has had a major effect on lots of industries, but there are limits to how far you can take it before quality suffers, and there is a reason why expensive countries like in the North and West "halves" of Europe can still hold a stake in the industry - if it was all about money, many more jobs and industries would have taken flight a decade or more ago IMO.

Isn't it the case Cheify, that there's also a worldwide shortage of (cheap, yet competent) engineers (in general)?


It's certainly true that no company guarantees a job... especially now - even the RFA are coming under the microscope this year in the most significant Strategic Defence Review for a long time, and they have proven themselves capable of withdrawing offers made (read the smallprint of your contract)... so I wouldn't get too smug.
The recession is a great excuse for companies to "restructure" and lay off any dead wood. It also enables them to play hardball with cadets and applicants because everyone's a bit nervous.
You have to look at the big picture though... the price of oil is going to rise ...forever!; (political and economic) pressure will be put on the aviation industry to become smaller; (until they invent Star Trek transporters) ships are the only way to shift large amounts of stuff from cheaper manufacturing and primary resource places to pricier consumer places.
Environmentalism will become more mainstream and institutionalised, and issues such as sea pollution will become more important, as the media begins to make known how 80% of our oxygen comes from the sea, and increasingly the food that is required to feed the world's growing coastal populations.
My money is also on increasing Unmanned space and automation on ships - robotics are often used to replace cheap labour, as they don't need all the welfare, food (and associated facilities), accommodation, health and safety, and insurance that 3rd-world crews do - at the cost of requiring more highly trained crews. The Borg already trains dual Deck & Engine officers... Electro OOW CoCs are reportedly expected in 2012. I think this trend may continue.
The industry will need to hire crews from reliable non-corrupt countries; so I think, as the economy slowly dips into the results of the recession (this will be a hard year.. well I think the recession will fully bottom in generalised terms out in about 2015), and slowly bobs back out again after companies have "streamlined" themselves (i.e. sacked loads of people who are stale), that there will be "some" jobs... and maybe a third or half of cadets will get something straight away.

Personally, I'm relaxed about the "no job at the end" thing, because I think the training will be good enough to ensure that you are more employable than many uni graduates in many different occupations. If you think about what doing a cadetship involves compared to rolling out of your fart sack to ponce down to lectures, it's got to look more appealing to any employer!

[Chiefy]

Re: What's up with Maersk

Bums on seats in this context means the way personnel are moving people about, there is little in the way of forward planning and they are using / recruiting to fill the spaces as and when required.

Flag state still govern who can sail on what ship the Danes have some rules that UK officers need to do a conversion course to suplement the UK ticket to sail on the DIS Flag.

I would agree with you the shortage is worldwide, they need to plan now for the future but as I said earlier there was redundancies early this year yet some how they are now short of captains!

As for EU standards being higher than anyone else, that is a dangerous path to go down, Maersk managed to run a ship aground in the middle fo the Singapore Straights (MAIB report out now) and that was a UK flag with UK Capt and Ch Off, you are only as good as your last **** up!

ISM is also v flexible the company can write thier QA manual to suit there own levels etc so long as they stick to them at audit time then no issues.

I arent aware of the Borg taking on Dual cadets as we only just got rid of the last lot

ETO cadets are the next big thing as there arent any Leckys going free, they traditionally came from the Coal Mines / Ship Yards and other heavy indusrty but now that scource has gone they have realised the need to train some up!

This is a good industry with good training / education that is very transferable should you want / need to.

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

ETO cadets are the next big thing as there arent any Leckys going free, they traditionally came from the Coal Mines / Ship Yards and other heavy indusrty but now that scource has gone they have realised the need to train some up!

So do they have ETOs or Leckies on their ships?
Only a handful of companies seem to offer strictly sparky cadetships from what I've seen.
How are they for (career related) study support?
http://www.tees.ac.uk/schools/sse/colu/courses.cfm

Bums on seats in this context means the way personnel are moving people about, there is little in the way of forward planning and they are using / recruiting to fill the spaces as and when required.

Bums on seats... so they aren't so fussy about who they take on (assuming requirements are met)
[youtube:3h24dtpv]aL9iOQEhwqk[/youtube:3h24dtpv]

Flag state still govern who can sail on what ship the Danes have some rules that UK officers need to do a conversion course to suplement the UK ticket to sail on the DIS Flag.

So, is it likely that they'll always have to have Danish, Dutch and British flags (and thus Danish and British cadets and ossifers - they seem to have withdrawn from the Dutch market...) just because of their North Sea activities, or what?

I arent aware of the Borg taking on Dual cadets as we only just got rid of the last lot

http://www.blivskibsofficer.dk/Hvordan- ... dannelser/

Didn't work out then?

I would agree with you the shortage is worldwide, they need to plan now for the future but as I said earlier there was redundancies early this year yet some how they are now short of captains!

...and Chiefys?!

I think they may have teamed up with another well-known scandinavian organisation to grab 'em young:
[youtube:3h24dtpv]pXxYJ8AAkbA[/youtube:3h24dtpv]

P.S. (what's ISM stand for?)
http://www.ism.ws/ ?!

[Chiefy]

Re: What's up with Maersk

ISM = Interntional Safety Management http://www.imo.org/humanelement/main...p?topic_id=287

Maersk has both but seeing as on a container job the job is the same... Reefer Box Technician with some engine room work when time permits. Last ETO Cadet I sailed with basically did the Engineer Course with add electricity, and came out with an HND and Class4 OOW, but again that might all be changing.

Using .EU officers is nothing to do with North Sea activities it's to do with the Flag that the vessel flys and rules of that Flag State and wether you meet the requirments, if they got rid of all UK flagged vessels then they (in theory) dont need UK officers, wether it would come to that or not is another matter.

[dawg]

Re: What's up with Maersk

The new Electro course (as opposed to the old ETO = Engine + a few sparks) is an FD not a HND, which tells you the way things are going.
Most marine leckies would probably have something like a HNC EE I reckon.

[Chiefy]

Re: What's up with Maersk

The new Electro course (as opposed to the old ETO = Engine + a few sparks) is an FD not a HND, which tells you the way things are going.
Most marine leckies would probably have something like a HNC EE I reckon.

Seems fair and reasonable

[RedWhiteAndBlue]

Re: What's up with Maersk

What is "the borg"? Im liking that video is it yours?