Employment prospects after doing Cadetship with Shell?

[celtic dreamer]

Hi folks,

I'm thinking of applying for the cadetship with Shell. I know that they don't employ everyone after they've trained them so I'm wondering what would the chances be of getting a job with another company in the event that one was successful in being employed by Shell?


This is particulary relevant as I'm in my 30's so after 3 or 4 years of training, if there were no jobs after all that training, I'd be in a right tight spot.


Also, what are Shell like to train with and what is the pay like during training? If you'd prefer to message me that's fine.

Thanks very much.


C.

[EH75]

I don't know anyone with Shell but from what I have read on this forum they sound like a pretty good outfit to train with and I was under the impression that there was quite a good chance of a job at the end. In any case I would imagine you would get good training, and also end up with a DCE which would be beneficial when looking for jobs once qualified anyway. I would take it. No hesitation. I heard they pay their cadets quite well also, but I have no idea if that's true.

I trained with a company who don't offer their cadets a job at the end of their training and haven't found anything yet, although I've only been applying for about a week so I wouldn't read too much into that.

[size4riggerboots]

A coursemate of mine was with Shell, he had a 2 yr golden handcuffs clause in his contract, so he got a job straight off with them, but that may well have changed now. He had good onboard training, but very few runs ashore. Also yes, you'll get your oil tickets, which is NOT to be sniffed at!

[IFHP]

Go for it - In the very unlikely event that you don't get a job afterwards you will have lots of LNG and Oil experience, you wont be able to get the DCE yet as you have to do 6 months (time as a cadet doesn't count) tanker time 3 months on the type of vessel you want the endorsement on. There are 1 month taskbook ones to speed up the process but on the whole it doesn't matter.

Doors will open from the likes of BP, Teekay etc. I am totally biased but a cadetship with an oil major is a great one.

Good Luck!

[Steve]

(time as a cadet doesn't count)

Do you have a reference for that?

[IFHP]

TANKERS

2.0 Tanker Familiarisation Training
2.1 Ratings assigned specific duties and responsibilities related to cargo or cargo equipment (eg pumpman) and all officers on tankers are required to have completed:

.1 at least 3 months of seagoing service on tankers in order to acquire adequate knowledge of safe operational practices; or
.2 a tanker familiarisation training programme approved by the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA) covering the syllabus given in paragraphs 2 to 7 of section A-V/1 of the STCW Code; or
.3 at least 30 days service under the supervision of qualified officers on a tanker of less than 3000 gt engaged on voyages not exceeding 72 hours.
2.2 In addition to the above, ratings are required to undertake the advanced fire fighting training programme specified in section A-VI/3 of the STCW Code.
3.0 Specialised Tanker Training
3.1 Oil Tankers
3.1.1 In addition to the requirements in paragraph 2.1 above, masters, chief engineer officers, chief mates, second engineer officers and any person, such as a cargo officer or cargo engineer officer, with immediate responsibility for loading, discharging and care in transit or handling of cargo in an oil tanker, are required to have completed:

.1 an MCA-approved specialised oil tanker training programme covering the syllabus in paragraphs 8 to 14 of section A-V/1 of the STCW Code; and
.2 at least 3 months sea service on an oil tanker.

3.2 Chemical Tankers
3.2.1 In addition to the requirements in paragraph 2.1 above, masters, chief engineer officers,chief mates, second engineer officers and any person, such as a cargo officer or cargo engineer officer, with immediate responsibility for loading, discharging and care in transit or handling of cargo in a chemical tanker are required to have completed:

.1 an MCA-approved specialised chemical tanker training programme covering the syllabus in paragraphs 15 to 21 of section A-V/1 of the STCW Code; and
.2 at least 3 months sea service on a chemical tanker.

3.3 Liquefied Gas Tankers
3.3.1 In addition to the requirements in paragraph 2.1 above, masters, chief engineer officers, chief mates, second engineer officers and any person, such as a cargo officer or cargo engineer officer, with immediate responsibility for loading, discharging and care in transit or handling of cargo in a liquefied gas tanker (LPG & LNG) are required to have completed:

.1 an MCA-approved specialised liquefied (gas tanker training programme covering the syllabus in paragraphs 22 to 34 of section A-V/1 of the STCW Code; and
.2 at least 3 months sea service on a liquefied gas tanker.

Dont say I dont do anything for you! MGN95

I have highlighted the bits in red but the crux of it is you have to do cargo watches as an OOW for the time towards the endorsement.

[GuinnessMan]

Sorry to disagree with you IFHP, but from reading the actual MGN, it reads to me that you only have to have completed 3 months on a tanker to get the endorsement and that the endorsement is required for those dealing with the bits you've highlighted?

(Please don't take this as me agreeing with the civil servant)

[IFHP]

2 different things GM - Tanker Familiarisation and DCE. Anyone can have Tanker Fam (Paragraph 2) i.e. Ratings and Officers.

In addition to having Tanker Fam and in order to get an endorsement on your COC - Paragraph 3 deals with the DCE for your COC. Cadets dont have immediate responsibility for cargo ops i.e. held a watch.

[GuinnessMan]

2 different things GM - Tanker Familiarisation and DCE. Anyone can have Tanker Fam (Paragraph 2) i.e. Ratings and Officers.

In addition to having Tanker Fam and in order to get an endorsement on your COC - Paragraph 3 deals with the DCE for your COC. Cadets dont have immediate responsibility for cargo ops i.e. held a watch.

Aye, I know, that's what I read, but my understanding of the MGN only says that those who have some interaction with the cargo must have the DCE and to have the DCE they had to complete 3 months on the tanker as well as the specialized course? It also doesn't say that they must have held the watch on their own to get the DCE, just that those will be on their own must have the DCE.

[IFHP]

As usual the MGN language isn't the best (no surprise there). It might not use the words "watch on their own" but that's what the MCA mean by responsibility. If a cadet upon passing his orals applies for a DCE they wont put it on until after the first trip as 3/O.

I have worked for an oil major for 16 years and we have lots of cadets. Upon passing exams and getting their tickets they cant get the DCE until after their first trip - due to not having a held a watch. Its a little bit chicken and the egg situation however as its their first trip they are being supervised whilst doing cargo. Just one of many of the little idiosyncrasies of the MCA.

[GuinnessMan]

2.0 Tanker Familiarisation Training
2.1 Ratings assigned specific duties and responsibilities related to cargo or cargo equipment (eg
pumpman) and all officers on tankers are required to have completed:

.1 at least 3 months of seagoing service on tankers in order to acquire adequate knowledge of
safe operational practices; or

.2 a tanker familiarisation training programme approved by the Maritime and Coastguard
Agency (MCA) covering the syllabus given in paragraphs 2 to 7 of section A-V/1 of the
STCW Code; or

.3 at least 30 days service under the supervision of qualified officers on a tanker of less than
3000 gt engaged on voyages not exceeding 72 hours.

2.2 In addition to the above, ratings are required to undertake the advanced fire fighting training
programme specified in section A-VI/3 of the STCW Code.

Aye, simple enough.

3.1.1 In addition to the requirements in paragraph 2.1 above, masters, chief engineer officers, chief
mates, second engineer officers and any person, such as a cargo officer or cargo engineer officer,
with immediate responsibility for loading, discharging and care in transit or handling of cargo in
an oil tanker, are required to have completed:

.1 an MCA-approved specialised oil tanker training programme covering the syllabus in
paragraphs 8 to 14 of section A-V/1 of the STCW Code; and

.2 at least 3 months sea service on an oil tanker.

At no point does it say that they have to held a watch on their own or in any other type of language. Just that those who will be doing it need to have the DCE, so in theory the cadet can get the DCE if they have been on a tanker for 3 months!?

I know ours tend to finish their cadetships with DCE's, so I will check with our crewing folks tomorrow and see what they say because from reading the MGN, there is nothing in there that says you need to have been doing things on your own to get the DCE.

[IFHP]

1000 pardons your Lordship - I shall stand by on the authority from your Crewing Folks tomorrow as obviously they part time for the MCA on issuing DCE's.

[GuinnessMan]

1000 pardons your Lordship - I shall stand by on the authority from your Crewing Folks tomorrow as obviously they part time for the MCA on issuing DCE's.

Whatever, they assist the guys in getting them so have more of a knowledge of the system than you or me....

[IFHP]

Seriously?

Yes - you seem like a chap who seems to enjoy sarcasam so thought you would appreciate the more simplistic version of our native language.

"Aye, simple enough"

Everyone is welcome to their opinion, I am a deck officer, I have applied and got a DCE for both Oil and Gas. I did my cadetship with an oil company serving exclusively with Oil and LNG, at the end of my cadetship I did not get a DCE. Upon completion of my 1st trip as 3/O I did for Oil only. 2nd trip as 3/O completed on LNG I was then able to apply for the Gas Endorsement - you are right, it is simple enough.

[GuinnessMan]

Yes - you seem like a chap who seems to enjoy sarcasam so thought you would appreciate the more simplistic version of our native language.

"Aye, simple enough"

Everyone is welcome to their opinion, I am a deck officer, I have applied and got a DCE for both Oil and Gas. I did my cadetship with an oil company serving exclusively with Oil and LNG, at the end of my cadetship I did not get a DCE. Upon completion of my 1st trip as 3/O I did for Oil only. 2nd trip as 3/O completed on LNG I was then able to apply for the Gas Endorsement - you are right, it is simple enough.

What sarcasm? Perhaps there has been some misinterpreting going on here as there was no sarcasm in my response to that. In my opinion, the requirements in chapter 2 for the tanker fam are simple enough. They're quite clear and easy to follow/understand. Interpret it however you will, but there was no sarcasm in that line.

The part that I was questioning was Chapter 3 because I didn't and I still don't quite follow your reasoning behind it as it didn't exactly match what I was reading in the MGN, hence why I questioned it. Also, as our crewing officers job to check that all the paperwork and qualifications are up to scratch, then they are much more likely to have a more up to date knowledge than you or me on what the requirements are.