Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

[Shkval]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Point taken. Another question, on this forum I've read a lot about offshore but most of the information is from deckies. What's it like for an Engine cadet to train with a company like Boston Putford, North Star, Sartor, where they have many multi-role vessels, and what happens if you end up on a standby vessel? Would you still get enough work to complete the portfolio and get your sea time? What are the pros and cons of offshore vs deep sea for engine cadets (and later engine officers)?
I hope I'm not asking dumb questions, it seems that to work offshore the deckies have to be specialised, does it work the same way for engineers?

[dawg]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

It's not type, it's age of he vessel. Going on a brand new spanking vessel is pointless as there is so much automation you won't actually do all that much "hands on" work (operation wise).

Go on a 30 year old vessel with minimal automation and everything is "hand-a-matic" and is the best way to learn (operation wise).

Except you don't always have a choice... some sponsors only have very new (i.e. less than 5-years' old!) ships that they put cadets on.

[Chiefy]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Anyone who says new ships dont teach you anything is talking piffle........

On the computer screen at the end of every remote switch, or operation button, pieace of electrical plumbing there is a real live bit of equipment and it WILL have a manual override and a local control set up. A new ship has new technology which is (in)famous for being unreliable. New ships have new engines of new design, often with new inovation which somtimes are even more trouble that the old tried and tested gear (I give you BOTH the Rt-Flex AND B&W ME engines). Some new ships have radical hull designs which can also lead to new inovations in the field of fixing cracks in the hull steel when they get the strength calculations wrong!

While it is true to say older is better for learning, I would suggest the learning is what you make of it. Every days a school day even for me


Now Off Shore v Deep Sea, this battle has waged for years It's a right thorney one too.
Traditionally Off Shore was made up of ex-fishermen and people from deep sea who wanted more time at home etc as it has pretty much always been 1:1, the technology was old and the ships older, but times and regulations have moved on, the deck team have DP (dynamic poistioning) to get to grips with and learn to use and abuse, however with DP there are classes DP 1,2,3,4 (I think) which mean levels of redundancy of kit, this includes engines and power production and command and control equipment, there are even add-ons for engineers for DP maintenance, not dis-similar to DCE's for tanker people.

Doing stand-by can be both bloody tedious BUT you can write up lots of your project work, you are after all supposed to base the tasks on what you have on the ship(s) you are on, so while launching a life boat might not be an option, there will be life rafts and maybe a daughter craft, which can be written about. Off shore is predominantly (exclusively) powered by medium soeed engines so you willl miss out on the big slow speed stuff...so you will need to pay attention in those lectures that cover those engines and design features, BUT you will (or should)know alot about medium speed engines, gear boxes and CPP equipment that the slow speed team dont This is also true(ish) for the cruise team, as they also tend to run on medium speed ships rather than big old stone crushed thundering along at a ponderous 80 rpm

So a simple question and here I am half way through a dissertation on the topic and not even 0630 local time.....now where is my tea?..............

[stronglead]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Kettles on chiefy

[Shkval]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

So if I train with a deep sea company on a large vessel (slow, big engine) and later on decide to try work offshore would I have any difficulties? Would I need additional courses, and be at a disadvantage compared to those who did train/work offshore? Or is this more the case for deckies rather than engineers? The main question boils down to does it really matter for engine cadets whether they do their cadetship with a deep sea company or offshore/supply, cruise? Or the important thing is just to get a sponsorship, get the certificate and then worry about such details?

[Chiefy]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Erm yes and no
Your ticket alows you to be "whatever rank" on ANY ship depending on if there are some special certs needed like Dangerous Cargo Certificates (for tankers). Additional course maybe needed BUT normally the employer will sort that bit, some arent mandatory but some maybe so swings and roundabouts.

But mainly no there isnt an issue going from deep sea to off shore and vice versa.

Main thing, get sponsored, get trained and qualified, pick the bones out of it from there

However if you have a preference (some here already have expressed a rpefernce for ferries and cruise ships) then by all means train with them, but if you want the career etc, fill yer boots and enjoy the ride

[GuinnessMan]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

No. You would not be at a disadvantage.

Basic point. Get trained, get your ticket and then decide what you want to stay on.

North sea would be one of my own brands of hell, whereas I love deep sea because we get all over the place.

[Shkval]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Cheers for your replies, guys. I want to do long deep sea trips and see the world but perhaps one day work closer to home, that is if I'll still be living in the UK. I hope to someday relocate somewhere the Sun does shine.

[Shkval]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Can someone explain the details of engine power and how it's related to limited/unlimited ticket for engineers? What are the actual regulations (numbers)? I'm looking at a few of the offshore companies I mentioned earlier and I see that many standby vessels have engine output of well below 2000 kW. Could training with offshore companies result in a limited ticket or they would make sure I get enough sea time on bigger vessels as well?

[Brimbo]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Can someone explain the details of engine power and how it's related to limited/unlimited ticket for engineers? What are the actual regulations (numbers)? I'm looking at a few of the offshore companies I mentioned earlier and I see that many standby vessels have engine output of well below 2000 kW. Could training with offshore companies result in a limited ticket or they would make sure I get enough sea time on bigger vessels as well?

A limited ticket is 3000KW or under, I've never heard of a cadet only getting a limited ticket from a cadetship with standby vessels, less than 3000KW is usually small ferries and the like, If in doubt ask your sponsor

[Chiefy]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Not sure of the actual numbers but limited tickets tend to be when you go for senior tickets ie limited second and chief.......internet not man enough to search teh MCA from here, but that'll be the place to go look

[Steve]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Requirements for engineering CoCs are covered in MGN 93(M): http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mcga-mnotice. ... 6FC619196F
3000kW limit only applies to 2nd's and Chief's tickets. Minimum 350kW for seatime to count towards OOW.

Additional requirements for certain types of ship are in MGN 95(M): http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mcga-mnotice. ... 967569F3DD

[Shkval]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

Good to know and I'll be asking my sponsor also. Yes, when I was looking I found these guidelines http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mcga-mnotice. ... D4E101F7C2 and http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mcga-mnotice. ... 6FC619196F which, like Chiefy said, refer to senior officers and I found a bit confusing. So it looks like it's not relevant to an engine cadet.


Edit: Thanks for the links Steve. That settles it.

[onara]

Re: Questions for Engineers (Cadets & Officers)

the 'wise sensai' knows best!

Close, but it should be sensei. Maybe just a typo though?


???????