Cadet mistreatment during Sea Phases

View Poll Results: I have had poor experiences due to lack of interest or bad management during my sea phases as cadet.

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  • Yes

    13 61.90%
  • No

    8 38.10%
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  1. #1

    Deck Officer (CoC: Master)
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    Cadet mistreatment during Sea Phases

    Hi Guys,

    I am collating info / stories on cadet mistreatment at sea (by mistreatment I mean the following: Verbal or physical abuse; substandard accommodation; lack of interest in your development; not taking your record book seriously, etc). I am a vice-chair of my local Nautical Institute branch and captain with a large shipping company. We are trying to get the Chamber of Shipping interested in cadet welfare, having many examples of poor treatment would go a long way to making this happen. Please post any incidents or experiences you have had. Keep it as anonymous as you like - also please bear in mind this is a public forum!

  2. #2

    Sponsoring Company
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    I would consider how you are asking the question and what you will do with the information...

    The title of the poll is 'poor experience due to lack of interest or bad management' however in your post you are talking about 'verbal or physical abuse'?

    Waving such a big wide stick isn't going to get the information you need, nor do I expect through an anonymous poll without any verification of the respondents. The Chamber are heavily involved in Cadet Welfare, both on a professional and personal level. However I wouldn't expect them to treat the results of your 'fact finding' in an open forum as a good representation of what is happening during a Cadet's sea phase.

    I think your intentions are good, but this isn't the way to go about it.

  3. The following user says Thank You to newbie for this useful post:

    Hatchorder (4th December 2016)

  4. #3

    Retired Radio Officer
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainS View Post
    Hi Guys,

    I am collating info / stories on cadet mistreatment at sea (by mistreatment I mean the following: Verbal or physical abuse; substandard accommodation; lack of interest in your development; not taking your record book seriously, etc). I am a vice-chair of my local Nautical Institute branch and captain with a large shipping company. We are trying to get the Chamber of Shipping interested in cadet welfare, having many examples of poor treatment would go a long way to making this happen. Please post any incidents or experiences you have had. Keep it as anonymous as you like - also please bear in mind this is a public forum!
    Forgive me for being an old cynic but is this going to be a repeat of the journalist woman who rocked up asking us to dish the dirt and disappearing when it wasn't forthcoming. Be careful what you say folks. CaptainS only joined 15 minutes ago and this is his first post.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    io parlo morse

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    GuinnessMan (30th November 2016)

  6. #4
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    Goms

    If you aren't interested in replying to the question then by all means don't. This has been started due to a large number of stories I, and other members of our branch have heard from local cadets. We aren't interested in newspaper stories - we are interested in the welfare of cadets. For those of us who were lucky enough to come up through large well managed companies this probably won't be an issue. I am slightly concerned we are already in the "Grumpy Old Man Syndrome" territory here.

    I can assure you I am not a troll - regardless of what endure thinks. If you read carefully I have already advised folk to be careful as this is a public forum. If you want to post - post - if not - don't.

  7. #5

    Deck Officer (CoC: Master)
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    Hi Newbie,

    Maybe you can tell me what information I do need? Also perhaps you can help by letting us know a better way "to go about it"? All we are looking for here is some real life examples. As I can assure you thats what the CoS will ask for if approached. Bear in mind that the many shipping companies under the Red Duster are customers of the CoS - so they have a vested interest in not "rocking the boat".

  8. #6

    Sponsoring Company
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainS View Post
    Hi Newbie,

    Maybe you can tell me what information I do need? Also perhaps you can help by letting us know a better way "to go about it"? All we are looking for here is some real life examples. As I can assure you thats what the CoS will ask for if approached. Bear in mind that the many shipping companies under the Red Duster are customers of the CoS - so they have a vested interest in not "rocking the boat".
    Hi CaptainS... I'm aware how the Chamber and MNTB are set up, we are a member and I attend. I would assume they would want information supplied by their members, therefore having credibility. I do see the obvious flaw in this, as what company would openly admit it isn't able to provide the correct onboard training experience.

    Could it not be the MCA rather than the CoS (or as well as) who should be the intended recipient of any findings? They outline the Training Providers obligations under SMarT (MGN455 - Points 8-10) - should they not be taking a greater role in enforcing and monitoring the quality of onboard training?

    I do wonder how many of the examples you might be presented with were handled ashore? Did they approach their sponsor, did they raise a grievance - what was the outcome. Did it instigate any change onboard (would they know?).

    Could you set up a more detailed survey (survey monkey?), asking more specific questions? Specify who you are and how the data will be used, how will you feed back to those who responded? Could you get Nautilus to support the survey, promoted in the Telegraph?

    As I said, the intention is good I just think you get a one-time shot at getting it right.

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    Hatchorder (30th November 2016)

  10. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by newbie View Post
    Hi CaptainS... I'm aware how the Chamber and MNTB are set up, we are a member and I attend. I would assume they would want information supplied by their members, therefore having credibility. I do see the obvious flaw in this, as what company would openly admit it isn't able to provide the correct onboard training experience.

    Could it not be the MCA rather than the CoS (or as well as) who should be the intended recipient of any findings? They outline the Training Providers obligations under SMarT (MGN455 - Points 8-10) - should they not be taking a greater role in enforcing and monitoring the quality of onboard training?

    I do wonder how many of the examples you might be presented with were handled ashore? Did they approach their sponsor, did they raise a grievance - what was the outcome. Did it instigate any change onboard (would they know?).

    Could you set up a more detailed survey (survey monkey?), asking more specific questions? Specify who you are and how the data will be used, how will you feed back to those who responded? Could you get Nautilus to support the survey, promoted in the Telegraph?

    As I said, the intention is good I just think you get a one-time shot at getting it right.

    Hi Newbie,

    We have actually already contacted several stakeholders - I won't go into details at the moment. We are at a very early stage here - depending on the results we can continue to gather info. I'm sure you're aware a young cadet is unlikely to raise a grievance or stand up to senior management onboard. I have heard horrendous stories about cadet treatment - cadets being stuck in cable trunks due to lack of cabins, being used as dogs bodies (for their whole cadetship), being forced to falsify rest hour records, deck cadets having no bridge time at the end of their sea time, undertaking risky jobs and being shouted down if they question it. The list goes on. What we're looking for at the moment are examples. It will be a long process, we are not rushing it. In fact, if you look through many of the forums you'll find plenty examples - I just wanted some collated in one thread to make it easier.

  11. #8

    Deck Cadet
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainS View Post
    Hi Guys,

    I am collating info / stories on cadet mistreatment at sea (by mistreatment I mean the following: Verbal or physical abuse; substandard accommodation; lack of interest in your development; not taking your record book seriously, etc). I am a vice-chair of my local Nautical Institute branch and captain with a large shipping company. We are trying to get the Chamber of Shipping interested in cadet welfare, having many examples of poor treatment would go a long way to making this happen. Please post any incidents or experiences you have had. Keep it as anonymous as you like - also please bear in mind this is a public forum!
    There are too many cases of mistreatment and abuse of cadets I could tell you including myself....

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  12. #9

    Deck Officer (CoC: OOW)
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    I always find lack of interest to be in the eyes of the beholder. There are cadets who seem to expect more interest from those on board than they show themselves

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    bobofinga (1st December 2016)

  14. #10

    Deck Officer (CoC: OOW)
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    Hi

    Just a few comments.

    - Voting is only available to registered members, so poll response will be limited to that group. Statistics tell me that only about 25% of our visitors actually have an account.
    - I would caution anybody giving accounts of negative experiences in this thread that, unless posted anonymously, your user name and other posts may reveal more than you think. Please be cautious and consider your own and your company's reputation. Please read the guidance in our terms of service (link at bottom of page).

    On a personal note, I must echo newbie's concerns about the quality of research. A simple yes/no entirely excludes important demographic factors and misses the opportunity to collect supporting data. Is nationality a factor? Type of ship? Shipboard response? Shoreside response? Individual or collective? Specific or general? The list goes on.

    Research into a relevant and important topic must always be applauded and as a member of the Nautical Institute I entirely appreciate the value of an independent organisation and its enthusiastic members working to better our industry. I understand that this is preliminary research but I would caution you to ensure that it is just that. If you proceed to a more detailed survey we would be happy to promote it amongst our members and social media followers.

    Chris
    Hello! I'm Chris. I'm away a lot so I'm sorry if it takes me a while to reply to messages, but I promise I'll get back to everyone. If it's urgent, please email me directly at christopher.doyle@officercadet.com. I'm on Twitter and LinkedIn, please feel free to follow/connect!

    Need books, Flip Cards or chartwork instruments? Visit SailorShop.co.uk!



 

 

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